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Re: ISO 8000 in Kodak Z712
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XYWE > Photo > Re: ISO 8000 in Kodak Z712 10 March 2007 08:14:06

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Re: ISO 8000 in Kodak Z712

David J. Littleboy 8 March 2007 18:40:18
 
"carrera d'olbani" <dolbani@yahoo.com>­ wrote:
On Mar 8, 11:23 pm, "acl" <achilleaslazari...­@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
On Mar 8, 2:02 pm, "carrera d'olbani" <dolb...@yahoo.com>­ wrote:
But I am surprsised somewhat how the Kodak designers could get 8000
out of a 1/2.5" sensor. The other reviews say that Z712 got a maximum
ISO of only 800. Perhaps it was a typo.
Well, if you lower your standards enough you can get as high as you
want. For example, the D200 at ISO
(this is suboptimal, you could make it better). In fact I have some
shots at effective ISO 6500000. Not a problem at all, just a matter of
redefining "acceptable image".

Here's the 5D at ISOs from 3200 to 25,600

http://www.pbase.co­m/davidjl/image/7535­9389/original

The 3200 image (downsampled to 6MP) looks like this.

http://www.pbase.co­m/davidjl/image/7535­9352/large

I am curious how you were able to make such a high (400000) ISO when
the camera allows only 1600 ?

Use manual mode and underexpose. Since handholding at 1/20 is hard at 75mm,
I turned on more room lights for the ISO 3200 image, but the 6,400 image was
f/5.6 and 1/40, the 12,800 was f/5.6 at 1/90, and the 25,600 was f/5.6 at
1/180.

David J. Littleboy
Tokyo, Japan


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Ray 8 March 2007 20:41:45 permanent link ]
 On Thu, 08 Mar 2007 05:02:09 -0800, carrera d'olbani wrote:

Well, no need for Fuji F30/F40 or in Sigma DP1 -- we got Kodak with
the ISO 8000 (yes, eight thousand). Combined with 12x zoom and AA
batteries, this small camera will be the one I will want. DPReview
paid our attention at the extreme sensitivity of the camera,
But I am surprsised somewhat how the Kodak designers could get 8000
out of a 1/2.5" sensor. The other reviews say that Z712 got a maximum
ISO of only 800. Perhaps it was a typo.

I think detailed information will reveal that the full 8000 ISO is not
available at full resolution. The 'Z' series does not shoot 'raw' either.
I'd suggest you look at the 'P' series - IS; raw,tiff,jpeg; full manual
mode. There are some good prices at the online store.

Add comment
Cgiorgio 8 March 2007 23:33:10 permanent link ]
 
"ray" <ray@zianet.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:p­an.2007.03.08­.16.41.45.532006@zia­net.com...
On Thu, 08 Mar 2007 05:02:09 -0800, carrera d'olbani wrote:
Well, no need for Fuji F30/F40 or in Sigma DP1 -- we got Kodak with
the ISO 8000 (yes, eight thousand). Combined with 12x zoom and AA
batteries, this small camera will be the one I will want. DPReview
paid our attention at the extreme sensitivity of the camera,
But I am surprsised somewhat how the Kodak designers could get 8000
out of a 1/2.5" sensor. The other reviews say that Z712 got a maximum
ISO of only 800. Perhaps it was a typo.
I think detailed information will reveal that the full 8000 ISO is not
available at full resolution. The 'Z' series does not shoot 'raw' either.
I'd suggest you look at the 'P' series - IS; raw,tiff,jpeg; full manual
mode. There are some good prices at the online store.
Neither do I. Kodak's own web site states a high sensitivity mode is
available with 3200 ISO at reduced resolution (1.2 MPixels). Due to the laws
of physics, it is highly unkilely that a camera with a 1/2.5" 7 MPixel
sensor would record anything besides noise at ISO 8000 (when used at normal
temperatures).


Add comment
JXStern 9 March 2007 17:27:38 permanent link ]
 On 8 Mar 2007 05:23:58 -0800, "acl" <achilleaslazarides­@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:
eg ISO 400 are noise reduced to the point of nausea. I mean, look at
this:
Most people like this thing, but when I look at it, I just see a total
lack of texture and extremely obvious signs of heavy noise reduction.

You'd rather trust the image stabilization to take the shot at ISO
100? May be fine as long as nothing moves.

It's nice to have the choice. After all, I might be taking some snaps
to put online at 320 pixels and compressed as heck.

J.

Add comment
Roger N. Clark 9 March 2007 19:18:24 permanent link ]
 acl wrote:
On Mar 9, 2:27 pm, JXStern <JXSternChange...@g­te.net> wrote:
On 8 Mar 2007 05:23:58 -0800, "acl" <achilleaslazari...­@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:
eg ISO 400 are noise reduced to the point of nausea. I mean, look at
this:
Most people like this thing, but when I look at it, I just see a total
lack of texture and extremely obvious signs of heavy noise reduction.
You'd rather trust the image stabilization to take the shot at ISO
100? May be fine as long as nothing moves.
It's nice to have the choice. After all, I might be taking some snaps
to put online at 320 pixels and compressed as heck.
J.
Did I say that ISO 400 or 8000 should not be there? I was just
pointing out that, given that this F30 camera is supposed to be much
better than other compacts at this sort of thing, and given that its
image quality is what it is at ISO 400, it is rather unlikely that
anything pretty will come out of the kodak at 4 stops less exposure.
This claim of ISO 8000 is nothing more than "digital ISO."
a 1/2.5" sensor at 7 megapixels is about 1.9 micron pixel pitch.
That performance is at the bottom of the graph in Figure 6 at:
http://www.clarkvis­ion.com/imagedetail/­digital.sensor.perfo­rmance.summary
The "unity gain ISO" is the A/D bit level where 1 bit = 1 electron.
For a 12-bit converter, and 1.9 micron pixels, unity gain ISO
is at best ISO 100 and probably lower. Any ISO above that
is essentially digital ISO. You can achieve higher effective
ISOs (than ISO 100) with post processing. Thus all cameras have
digital ISO with post processing.

Roger
Add comment
David J Taylor 9 March 2007 20:00:41 permanent link ]
 Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark) wrote:
[]
This claim of ISO 8000 is nothing more than "digital ISO."
a 1/2.5" sensor at 7 megapixels is about 1.9 micron pixel pitch.
[]
Roger

Just a typo, I think.

David


Add comment
JXStern 10 March 2007 08:14:06 permanent link ]
 On 9 Mar 2007 05:54:40 -0800, "acl" <achilleaslazarides­@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:
Did I say that ISO 400 or 8000 should not be there? I was just
pointing out that, given that this F30 camera is supposed to be much
better than other compacts at this sort of thing, and given that its
image quality is what it is at ISO 400, it is rather unlikely that
anything pretty will come out of the kodak at 4 stops less exposure.

Well OK.

Back in the ancient days of film, you were free to push film speeds,
knowing what would result. I think it's a good thing if you can do
the same with digital, keep the auto features running with a bogus ISO
setting. Your point about quality is well taken.

My first (and so far only) digital camera had an effective ISO of
about 50 and no way to override, so I'm eager for better real
sensitivity and any workable overrides.

J.

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XYWE > Photo > Re: ISO 8000 in Kodak Z712 10 March 2007 08:14:06

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